I'm a full time professional musician (viola). i started out with a few handheld power tools. then when i was ready to setup my shop i went to my luthier and asked what i should get. he lived vicariously through me. powermatic 14" bandsaw, 8" shopfox 3hp jointer with 76" extra long bed, bosch cm10gd scms, lunch box planer. i have had zero desire to upgrade since. ironically I've been entertaining thoughts of selling my jointer because i do most of my work at the bench with hand tools. but every time i start a bigger project with lots of milling, i am glad i have that beast of a jointer. i, like you, spent hours chasing perfection with those stupid straight knives. then i realized that the jointer is for rough work. i will hit the show surfaces with a hand plane anyway. so now i don't even care about the baker's half dozen nicks in the jointer knives.
I've used a friends Hammer A3-41 with factory fitted spiral head and the noise is dramatically reduced from the standard knives. To the extent that I would happily use it without hearing protection, which I would never entertain on my own machine. The finish from that machine, once properly set up, was outstanding. Better than any traditional knife machine I've used.
So for me the noise and finish quality would be the reasons to choose spiral. We don't have the Shelix heads over here, so can't comment on those.
given the amount i use them as a hobbyist, i can't justify the extra $$ to upgrade to helical heads. (Edit) but if the sound difference really is dramatic I might have to upgrade. I went with the Mikita 2012nb because it was supposed to be quieter than other lunch boxers. It still screams and I use hearing protection. Does anyone have links to data showing difference in noise output of straight vs helical?
Hi Jesse, apples with apples. There is specific info from Hammer/Felder regarding the noise output on their straight knives versus the helical. It should be on their website. I currently have one of each in the 300mm Hammer thicknesser/planer combos as I am currently upgrading/changing my workspace and the noise level reduction is very noticeable even without proper quantification such as measuring with a sound meter. As to other spiral knife setups I do not know largely due to the fact there are multiple types from different manufacturers. The layout of the spiral, quantity of cutters and who knows what else all have a part to play. My dad had a Dewalt lunchbox planer and it screamed like a banshee. Having a 300kg machine (or greater)with large chunks of cast iron certainly helps as well for noise deadening.
I greatly enjoyed this. Thank you. And congrats on the growing fan base! I hope you’re able to figure out the allergy situation and find a workable solution.
Hilarious S curve! I got the shelix heads for my 6” jointer and 15” planer. I can put a decent finish on my boards and I hold a few thousands dimension on my planer. I find that I still get some machine marks, I suppose I could / should run the cutters faster because they are carbide but I never bothered to investigate further.
If you chip a tooth you can rotate the offending tooth within a few minutes and get back to work. I did that once when planing some reclaimed mahogany from an old boat and ran a screw through it.
I have a bit of an Oak allergy too, most notably when I used to burn Oak logs in the fireplace’s wood burning stove insert. No longer use it at all. If I am sawing Oak for anything other than a trim cut, and especially for cutting larger quantities, I use a 3M face dust mask ( on Amazon) with replacement dual filters. I even use a face mask with my central shop vac on. There is always going to be some fine dust in the air so I also run a HEPA room filter fan to help. I try to avoid using Oak and prefer White or New Zealand Pine. A joy to work with my handtools and no allergies. I avoid using almost of my power tools now except for the bandsaw, to keep dust to a minimum. Spalted wood and its mold can add to the problem.
That's interesting that you have an Oak allergy. I always thought Oak was fairly benign, but recently begun to question if I might be allergic to it. I've been allergic to exotics like Cocobolo and Zebrano for years, so why not Oak?
And yes I also wear a 3M full face mask for dusty operations, but wearing it when doing hand work is a bridge too far for me. If I have to dress like a spaceman to do my hobby I'll find something else to do.
It is mostly when I burned it in the closed wooden stove, but could have been other allergens like mold spores etc. It is more of a sensitivity to it then a documented allergy with severe symptoms. In the shop it is only the ambient oak saw dust, no burning in there. The face mask and HEPA filter and using handtools for sawing etc mitigates the issue. Any Sanding is done outside and I still wesr my filter mask.
So it’s good for me and everyone that you have had a different experience!
Please tell me more. I have had both types of cutter-heads, straight knives and spiral.
I still have to wear hearing protection whatever I run. Then again I have great hearing and I’m over 65 and I’m a bit sensitive to loud noises. Perhaps I did something wrong when I installed spiral cutter heads? How did you get such good results?
The graph is 100% accurate currently in the third phase lol
I'm a full time professional musician (viola). i started out with a few handheld power tools. then when i was ready to setup my shop i went to my luthier and asked what i should get. he lived vicariously through me. powermatic 14" bandsaw, 8" shopfox 3hp jointer with 76" extra long bed, bosch cm10gd scms, lunch box planer. i have had zero desire to upgrade since. ironically I've been entertaining thoughts of selling my jointer because i do most of my work at the bench with hand tools. but every time i start a bigger project with lots of milling, i am glad i have that beast of a jointer. i, like you, spent hours chasing perfection with those stupid straight knives. then i realized that the jointer is for rough work. i will hit the show surfaces with a hand plane anyway. so now i don't even care about the baker's half dozen nicks in the jointer knives.
The noise of those knives is gut wrenching I couldn’t take it and splurge on a shelix head
So the spiral heads or shelix heads do not quiet the noise at all! I have used both and I still wear hearing protection with the spiral cutters.
Just so you know, the biggest advantage is you can replace the indexable cutters if you ever wear them out.
One edge will last years of normal use because it’s carbide and you have 4 rotations of the inserts.
The other advantage is if you damage an edge you can rotate the chipped insert, quickly and then get back to it.
In my humble opinion you get a better finish with the steel knives because it’s a sharper edge.
The disadvantage is to change the blades when resharpened takes some time unless you do it often maybe or have a machine that’s easy to set up.
Myself I get my milled boards to close but still roughed dimensions, then I hand work my boards to final dimensions with a hand plane or scraper.
I hope this helps.
I've used a friends Hammer A3-41 with factory fitted spiral head and the noise is dramatically reduced from the standard knives. To the extent that I would happily use it without hearing protection, which I would never entertain on my own machine. The finish from that machine, once properly set up, was outstanding. Better than any traditional knife machine I've used.
So for me the noise and finish quality would be the reasons to choose spiral. We don't have the Shelix heads over here, so can't comment on those.
given the amount i use them as a hobbyist, i can't justify the extra $$ to upgrade to helical heads. (Edit) but if the sound difference really is dramatic I might have to upgrade. I went with the Mikita 2012nb because it was supposed to be quieter than other lunch boxers. It still screams and I use hearing protection. Does anyone have links to data showing difference in noise output of straight vs helical?
Hi Jesse, apples with apples. There is specific info from Hammer/Felder regarding the noise output on their straight knives versus the helical. It should be on their website. I currently have one of each in the 300mm Hammer thicknesser/planer combos as I am currently upgrading/changing my workspace and the noise level reduction is very noticeable even without proper quantification such as measuring with a sound meter. As to other spiral knife setups I do not know largely due to the fact there are multiple types from different manufacturers. The layout of the spiral, quantity of cutters and who knows what else all have a part to play. My dad had a Dewalt lunchbox planer and it screamed like a banshee. Having a 300kg machine (or greater)with large chunks of cast iron certainly helps as well for noise deadening.
Beg to differ about the noise but that is ok cheers i no what I no
Hope you get better, I miss your writings
I greatly enjoyed this. Thank you. And congrats on the growing fan base! I hope you’re able to figure out the allergy situation and find a workable solution.
Hilarious S curve! I got the shelix heads for my 6” jointer and 15” planer. I can put a decent finish on my boards and I hold a few thousands dimension on my planer. I find that I still get some machine marks, I suppose I could / should run the cutters faster because they are carbide but I never bothered to investigate further.
If you chip a tooth you can rotate the offending tooth within a few minutes and get back to work. I did that once when planing some reclaimed mahogany from an old boat and ran a screw through it.
I have a bit of an Oak allergy too, most notably when I used to burn Oak logs in the fireplace’s wood burning stove insert. No longer use it at all. If I am sawing Oak for anything other than a trim cut, and especially for cutting larger quantities, I use a 3M face dust mask ( on Amazon) with replacement dual filters. I even use a face mask with my central shop vac on. There is always going to be some fine dust in the air so I also run a HEPA room filter fan to help. I try to avoid using Oak and prefer White or New Zealand Pine. A joy to work with my handtools and no allergies. I avoid using almost of my power tools now except for the bandsaw, to keep dust to a minimum. Spalted wood and its mold can add to the problem.
Cheers.
That's interesting that you have an Oak allergy. I always thought Oak was fairly benign, but recently begun to question if I might be allergic to it. I've been allergic to exotics like Cocobolo and Zebrano for years, so why not Oak?
And yes I also wear a 3M full face mask for dusty operations, but wearing it when doing hand work is a bridge too far for me. If I have to dress like a spaceman to do my hobby I'll find something else to do.
It is mostly when I burned it in the closed wooden stove, but could have been other allergens like mold spores etc. It is more of a sensitivity to it then a documented allergy with severe symptoms. In the shop it is only the ambient oak saw dust, no burning in there. The face mask and HEPA filter and using handtools for sawing etc mitigates the issue. Any Sanding is done outside and I still wesr my filter mask.
Haven’t see you around here for quite a while, hope you are doing great. Happy Holidays!!
Happy Xmas Ed, hope you’re feeling inspired to pick up plane and pen in 2024.
Hope you are well Ed. Have not seen any posts from you in quite a while. Miss reading them.
Cheers,
Michael
So it’s good for me and everyone that you have had a different experience!
Please tell me more. I have had both types of cutter-heads, straight knives and spiral.
I still have to wear hearing protection whatever I run. Then again I have great hearing and I’m over 65 and I’m a bit sensitive to loud noises. Perhaps I did something wrong when I installed spiral cutter heads? How did you get such good results?